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The Greatest Of All Pleasures Are The Guilty Ones. [userpic]

Snerkage: The ID Edition

August 12th, 2005 (09:39 am)

http://www.forwardbiased.com/forward_biased/2005/08/how_many_sides_.html Heh heh.

Anyway, my belated two cents on the recent flap over Intelligent Design being taught in schools:
Yes, it's bullsh*t. But the problem isn't that the president is mouthing off about the need to teach it, or that Kansas (What is the deal with Kansas, anyway?) is listening. It's the fact that one screwy guy at the top can change the curriculum for the whole country, or one screwy board can change the curriculum for the whole state.

I'd bet dollars to donuts that some of the people groaning the loudest over this mess are also the ones who push the hardest to keep the schools uniformly run by the state. You make it possible for one guy to be in charge of all that, don't be surprised when the wrong guy gets to be in charge.

Decentralize, privatize, and let the parents pick the school. I can so easily see a new industry in education exploding and some greedy capitalist doing for grade school mathematics what Wal*Mart did for socks and toilet paper.

Comments

Posted by: Trixter ([info]autobottrixter)
Posted at: August 12th, 2005 02:44 pm (UTC)

Getting the Chinese to make them cheaply and in bulk?

Posted by: The Greatest Of All Pleasures Are The Guilty Ones. ([info]obsequiosity)
Posted at: August 12th, 2005 03:56 pm (UTC)

I'd send tons of Hispanic immigrants to college in exchange for working in one of my teacher farms for a paltry sum for a few years (seeing as they're already here), but yeah, same idea.

For parents willing to cut corners all the way down to the three R's, I think you could carve out a niche with a bare bones school. Then there'd be the Target schools, the mall boutique overpriced schools. Education would be as easily attainable as underwear.

--Obs, It'll never happen, but I think it'd work if we let it.

Posted by: Trixter ([info]autobottrixter)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 02:58 am (UTC)

I think I'd like your argument more if I had ever been able to foot the bill at Victoria's Secret.

Posted by: The Greatest Of All Pleasures Are The Guilty Ones. ([info]obsequiosity)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 01:24 pm (UTC)

Ah. Here's the thing:

Suppose there was an outcry that too many people are going without underwear because the greedy capitalists either make it too expensive or too shoddy. So now part of your real estate taxes will go to a fund that will distribute underwear to everyone.

Part of the crowd demands boxers. Part of the crowd demands briefs. One part demands that no one should allowed to get anything but thongs. (We're ignoring the people who are paying the tax and yet they go commando. That's an issue to itself.) By centralizing underwear, we're cutting down on the amount of colors and styles that are available. We are stifling our crotches.

I think you'll Hanes education covers the same subjects as a VS education, just not quite as showily. But by putting the state in charge, you'll just make it more difficult to get even a Hanes education in the cut you prefer. Additionally, at the moment only the superrich get Victoria's because everyone has to pay for Victoria's on top of the Hanes they also pay for but don't use.

--Obs, Always had a thing for the plain cotton, anyway.

Posted by: Gigerlicious ([info]gigerlicious)
Posted at: August 12th, 2005 02:47 pm (UTC)

This is the reason I love Michigan's charter system. We try not to be embarassed by our standardized test system.

Posted by: ((Anonymous))
Posted at: August 12th, 2005 03:13 pm (UTC)

Thanks for the link!

Obi-Wan
http://www.forwardbiased.com/

Posted by: The Greatest Of All Pleasures Are The Guilty Ones. ([info]obsequiosity)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 01:42 am (UTC)

Thank Paul Hsieh from Noodle Food. I stoled it from him.

Posted by: mouse_pad ([info]mouse_pad)
Posted at: August 12th, 2005 06:09 pm (UTC)

Stop having all that common sense. There's no room for that in government!

Posted by: Steve-o Stonebraker ([info]steve_dash_o)
Posted at: August 12th, 2005 07:37 pm (UTC)

I can't help but wonder whether decentralizing school curriculum to the county level or lower wouldn't lead to *more* students getting shitty curriculum choices made by the hicks in charge. It would be happening in smaller pieces, but, I really wouldn't be confident that there would be a net gain.

Posted by: z4nd4r ([info]z4nd4r)
Posted at: August 12th, 2005 07:59 pm (UTC)

That's my worry too.

The guy that would corner the market would have Religion (Baptist or other equally independant-thought-choking form of Xianity that would teach straight up Fundie Creationism), Reading, Riting, and Rithmetic. (There are FOUR R's) He would start this in devout Christian counties across the US, starting in the south. Then it would migrate until all the happy little monkeys are toeing the Party Line. And the US becomes a third world nation.

Posted by: Finback ([info]finback)
Posted at: August 12th, 2005 11:56 pm (UTC)

Actually, see my recent post about one system wants to introduce ID.. and faze out the reading and rithmetic.

Posted by: The Greatest Of All Pleasures Are The Guilty Ones. ([info]obsequiosity)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 01:39 am (UTC)

I note you completely skipped the "privatize" line, or the crack about Wal*Mart. I'm talking about independent schools who receive no county funding, competing for parental dollars. (Worried about the poor? Set up a charity that hands out vouchers. You could even control which curriculae you'd hand money out for.)

Yes, it possible the curriculum would suffer in some schools. But they wouldn't stay open long. In the meantime, I won't have to subsidize the ID school while sending my own kids to a real school. ID would have to sell itself on its own merits to parents who are spending their education dollars where they wish.

You seem to think the nationalized curriculum is tempering the bad stuff; I think it's spreading it by allowing a small vocal group to control from the top down rather than having to start from the bottom up.

There are thousands of other little choices that I think parents should be able to customize (Do we allow The Bible As Literature classes? Do we use the Howard Zinn History Book or the Paul Johnson or both?)

You may think parents can't be trusted to make good decisions about their children's education unless they're forced to make the same ones you would; but I say give them a chance. You'd be surprised.

--Obs

Posted by: Gigerlicious ([info]gigerlicious)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 03:19 am (UTC)

Love the link, by the way.

I'm inclined to agree here - let everyone set their own educational path, just with the caveat that most universities and colleges are going to want to see high scores on accredited national exams, and actual science. Any actual brainwashing can be stainsticked out at Harvard or whathaveyou. The entire ID fear seems a big to do about nothing.

Posted by: Steve-o Stonebraker ([info]steve_dash_o)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 05:13 am (UTC)

I think privitizing would possibly be even worse (in the limited good/bad domain of "how many students are learning science vs. how many are learning insane dogma?") than local government control.

Posted by: The Greatest Of All Pleasures Are The Guilty Ones. ([info]obsequiosity)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 01:13 pm (UTC)

So allowing the zealous parents who would otherwise just screw up their own child's education to join the county school board and screw up the education of every child in four or five different communities is better. Got it.

Posted by: Steve-o Stonebraker ([info]steve_dash_o)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 03:27 pm (UTC)

It feels as if you are deliberately not listening to what I'm saying.

Posted by: The Greatest Of All Pleasures Are The Guilty Ones. ([info]obsequiosity)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 04:24 pm (UTC)

Likewise.

Posted by: PMMJ ([info]cheetahmaster)
Posted at: August 13th, 2005 01:10 pm (UTC)
Green Arrow

(What is the deal with Kansas, anyway?)

Man, if only scientists could figure that out once and for all...

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